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Old 06-26-2018, 12:50 AM   #1521
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuestionableEnigma View Post
I'd like to get some help on an issue with some bones. Some very few models I have when using the waist bone or implement the waist bone, this weird thing happens where it kind of almost acts like the master/mother bone. Even if I remove the bone and re-apply it, the problem still happens. Any ideas?

Also got done with the motion where my solution for it was solved with the use of waist bones. Very short and simple as usual. Shouldn't worry about editing all my motions too hard when I try to make them less tedious to edit in case for other particular models, since they are small (to be honest, this motion is actually kind of large in comparison to most others, but it's still short time-wise and kind of rushy? Not sure if this is a habit of mines for these.) Bonus for not being lazy and actually kind making mediocre names for these rather then "Unnamed Motion #X". For more specifics on the motion, it is recommended to use a model with an able tongue bone or slider for Receiver. The models used in the motion for reference are Komainu for Receiver and Montecore's Tiger model for Giver.

I wonder if it'll be useful to add a text document along with the motion for insight on where specifically you need to edit a few frames and bones when using other models. I was thinking that might be a good option.
4 legs, no ik bones.
you have some sort of broken leg fetish?

the text file will probably like throwing water into a desert. im certain writing it won't reap much usefulness.
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Old 06-26-2018, 10:08 AM   #1522
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Originally Posted by guthix View Post
4 legs, no ik bones.
you have some sort of broken leg fetish?
...Explain? I'm not sure what that's entirely implying. The Komainu I used for the Receiver had the same 'double leg on leg' bone structure but it cooperates with the waist fine. It's only an issue with Clan Hail and some other model I got recently. That recent model doesn't have the double leg thing.

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the text file will probably like throwing water into a desert. im certain writing it won't reap much usefulness.
Mm, alright.
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Old 06-26-2018, 03:46 PM   #1523
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuestionableEnigma View Post
...Explain? I'm not sure what that's entirely implying. The Komainu I used for the Receiver had the same 'double leg on leg' bone structure but it cooperates with the waist fine. It's only an issue with Clan Hail and some other model I got recently. That recent model doesn't have the double leg thing.



Mm, alright.
>4 legs.
basically a non standard bone structure with unknown problems, the issue is in its self that the model doesn't follow the same architecture as everyone else.

>no ik bones.
for a bone to bend without manual input, it either needs to be an ik chain or have joints. In your case the legs go up because the leg bones arent ik, not because of the waist bone.
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Old 06-26-2018, 07:05 PM   #1524
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guthix View Post
>4 legs.
basically a non standard bone structure with unknown problems, the issue is in its self that the model doesn't follow the same architecture as everyone else.

>no ik bones.
for a bone to bend without manual input, it either needs to be an ik chain or have joints. In your case the legs go up because the leg bones arent ik, not because of the waist bone.
Ahh, okay. So, I assume it's possible to fix this issue? (not that I highly know how to do that.) I can deal with that, since it's only possibly 2 models out of a lot.
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Old 06-26-2018, 09:44 PM   #1525
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Originally Posted by QuestionableEnigma View Post
Ahh, okay. So, I assume it's possible to fix this issue? (not that I highly know how to do that.) I can deal with that, since it's only possibly 2 models out of a lot.
Basically what needs to happen is that the bones that the legs are already weighted to, need to be put in an IK chain. That will force the bones in the legs to obey the positions of the IK bones in the ankles rather than being controlled by the center bone (and therefore, the waist), keeping them in place unless those ankle IKs are moved.

The fastest slapdash ways to do that would be to rename those bones into the same name as the IK bones that already exist, then merge duplicate bone names, or to convert the existing bone types into IK-affected bones (the ones that turn yellow) and then set IKs at the same position as the ankles (with target bones in the same position as the toes). Either way, those bones would still have to be adjusted afterward to ensure they bend at the right spot and the right direction. Definitely back your model up before trying this, and try to read any IK-making tutorials you can find.

Be aware that if your model doesn't have a master bone, once you associate the legs with IKs you'll have to move both ankle IKs and the center bone at the same time in order to move the whole model around.
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Old 06-27-2018, 09:14 AM   #1526
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I gave it a look over in editor and did some very light comparisons. What specifically should I be looking for? The leg bone names are basically identical, minus Clan Hail being an exception with the additional bones that branch from the top leg bones (leg 0?). What are the duplicate leg bones that have the D in them? I'm guessing those aren't necessary since I've seen other models without it. Took a bit closer look and she does have IK-chained legs, but they were obscured by the leg D layer, along with an IK bone that wasn't familiar to me and couldn't see where was it at when I highlighted it.

The second model with the same issue is just about as normal as any other model it looks like.

Some delving around the tutorials... I don't think I found anything that I found relevant to the problem. Well, it's not entirely 'that' important since it's only two models. I'll figure it out later down the road when I want to start
seriously cracking down on bones.
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Old 06-27-2018, 07:55 PM   #1527
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuestionableEnigma View Post
I gave it a look over in editor and did some very light comparisons. What specifically should I be looking for? The leg bone names are basically identical, minus Clan Hail being an exception with the additional bones that branch from the top leg bones (leg 0?). What are the duplicate leg bones that have the D in them? I'm guessing those aren't necessary since I've seen other models without it. Took a bit closer look and she does have IK-chained legs, but they were obscured by the leg D layer, along with an IK bone that wasn't familiar to me and couldn't see where was it at when I highlighted it.

The second model with the same issue is just about as normal as any other model it looks like.

Some delving around the tutorials... I don't think I found anything that I found relevant to the problem. Well, it's not entirely 'that' important since it's only two models. I'll figure it out later down the road when I want to start
seriously cracking down on bones.
Try looking at the model in 'weight' mode. If the mesh lights up red when you click on a bone that isn't part of the IK chain, then the IK isn't controlling the mesh at all. The quickest way would be

1. Move the leg bones that are part of the IK chain (that is, the type-2 yellow bones) above the other leg bones in the bone order. (If they are already above them, this step is not necessary.)

2. Assuming the bones the legs are weighted to have the same names as the corresponding bones in the IK chain, go to Bone -> Merge Same-named Bones. This will eliminate the non-chained leg bones and transfer the mesh rigging onto the bones that are part of the chain with the same names.

3. Compare the bones in the IK chain to the legs of some other models that already have IKs on their legs. Specifically you want to have similar settings in the "Link" box on the right side of the editor window for the ankle IK bones (the orange ones).

The target of the IK should be the ankle bone, the knee and thigh bones should be in the link box with the knee first and then the thigh, and for a PMX model, angular limitation for the knees should be enabled with x-axis angular limits of -180 to -0.5 degrees. Limits for the y and z axis should be zero. Angular limits should be disabled for the thighs.

Between the target and the link boxes, you should see two boxes marked "Loop" and "Unit angle". These should be set at 40 and 114.5916 respectively for the ankle IKs of a PMX model.

4. For the toe IKs, the settings are a little different. The target should be the "toe target" bone (the pink, type-6 bones that can't normally be seen), the only linked bone should be the ankle, and the Loop should be set to 3 and the Unit angle to either 114.5916 or 229.1831 (which is the first number doubled). Angular limitation should not be enabled.

Bear in mind IKs may not function the same in the editor as they do in MMD. In PMDEditor when I move legs they fold inwards instead of forward, but in MMD itself they behave normally.

The "D" bones are special manipulators that override the IKs (since the rotations don't function like they normally do when IKs are enabled). Most motions don't use them and I wouldn't bother; the IKs are usually good enough to get the legs into the right positions. That said, if they're already there I wouldn't delete them either.
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Old 07-01-2018, 02:51 AM   #1528
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I found it :D

It's Sims 4 hair. I poked into a dA group based on game extractions and it almost smacked me in the face. Never fails, you spend hours for looking for something and then it turns up when you least expect it... now if only I hadn't found it at 2:30 in the morning... well, at least I'm not working tomorrow.
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Old 07-01-2018, 10:29 AM   #1529
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Some models take 2 years to find in an obscure Chinese forum.
Others are just dead troll bait. like this one:
https://www.deviantart.com/lilithzat...OSED-442049954
im fully aware that the maker most likely quit mmd and its not obtainable, but I still keep it under my radar from time to time [at this point out of pure spite]
and see the dl count rise every year.
this hobby is cancer.
even as I "quit" I still keep gathering models ill never use, waiting for my hard drive to kick the bucket again.
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Old 07-01-2018, 12:12 PM   #1530
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guthix View Post
Some models take 2 years to find in an obscure Chinese forum.
Others are just dead troll bait. like this one:
https://www.deviantart.com/lilithzat...OSED-442049954
im fully aware that the maker most likely quit mmd and its not obtainable, but I still keep it under my radar from time to time [at this point out of pure spite]
and see the dl count rise every year.
this hobby is cancer.
even as I "quit" I still keep gathering models ill never use, waiting for my hard drive to kick the bucket again.
:iknowthatfeeling:

I had a few ideas about solving the password, but the extremely low DL count suggests it's not that easy. I have hundreds, maybe thousands of models I'll never use, but I want them all the same in case I have an idea that does require them, I'll be ready.

And I don't know about you but I back up all my MMD stuff on DVD every six months. It's starting to get ridiculous with the amount of stuff I have though, it takes over 20 DVDs to do a backup because my collection is over 100GB now. I'm about to switch over to burning on Blu-Ray instead, since these are just "in case shit happens" backups on hard physical media to avoid drive failure problems. There's like two boxes full of burnt DVDs in my closet that I could throw most of out due to redundancy but can't bring myself to because hey, you never know... the newer backup might have a burn error...

EDIT: And here I was thinking duplicating the eye shadow on the face texture was going to be the hard part... not only did the hair have a lot of unnecessary duplicate mesh, and most of the usable mesh had no normals assigned to it whatsoever, but it's not even close to the right size, and my early attempts to resize by a nice, consistent proportion were way off. Looks like I'm going to have to eyeball this...
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Old 07-02-2018, 03:59 PM   #1531
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did you try scaling only one axis or a part of the hair?
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Old 07-02-2018, 08:40 PM   #1532
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Originally Posted by guthix View Post
did you try scaling only one axis or a part of the hair?
I did, I also tried scaling each axis at different proportions, and that was the solution I ultimately settled on; reference pictures seemed to make it clear the z-axis depth was proportionally greater than the height and width. I also shifted the x-position slightly negative relative to the original.

I think she's just about done (at least as far as heads go), my main concern was that it seemed like her hairline is just a little too high on her forehead compared to the original, but I cannot bring it any lower or her part will clip through the top of her skull. It would be helpful if I knew if the original editor deleted the top mesh of her skull. Also, it seems like the bangs are supposed to almost completely obscure her left eye, but I can't move the hair too far left or it'll clip into the eye where it meets the head, which the original clearly does not.

I'm at the point where I'm ready to say "close enough"; it's a stroke of luck I even managed to find the right parts and techniques to duplicate her in the first place. Now I just have to clean up a few small gaps and fix up the normals; I let PMDEditor automatically generate them and that resulted in a lot of perpendicular normal pairs that cause weird reflections at certain angles when you use a sphere on the hair. There are literally hundreds that have to be smoothed.

Also there's another fan character I want to try to dupe; she's more complex in design because of her weird ass bangs (they're Haruka's chopped in half and then extensively messed with) but easier because I know where all the parts come from.

Yay for sleep deprivation
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Old 07-03-2018, 05:51 AM   #1533
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>my main concern was that it seemed like her hairline is just a little too high on her forehead compared to the original
nope

>Also, it seems like the bangs are supposed to almost completely obscure her left eye
a lot of people are blind to seams and body color mismatching. I really doubt they will notice that eye is uncovered twice the size. especially if its at an angle.
sometimes I just load the model with a few motions, if I can't pick up the issue during them, I say good enough.

>Yay for sleep deprivation
i'm not sure the loss of focus from sleep deprivations is worth redoing everything. that feeling, when you find out you fucked something up 3 hours ago.
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Old 07-03-2018, 05:52 PM   #1534
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guthix View Post
>my main concern was that it seemed like her hairline is just a little too high on her forehead compared to the original
nope

>Also, it seems like the bangs are supposed to almost completely obscure her left eye
a lot of people are blind to seams and body color mismatching. I really doubt they will notice that eye is uncovered twice the size. especially if its at an angle.
sometimes I just load the model with a few motions, if I can't pick up the issue during them, I say good enough.

>Yay for sleep deprivation
i'm not sure the loss of focus from sleep deprivations is worth redoing everything. that feeling, when you find out you fucked something up 3 hours ago.
This is why I take notes extensively. I have a 177KB text file of nothing but notes I've taken on editing Idolmaster models ever since I started doing it in 2012, everything from body proportions to character height vs size ratio to bone positions to texture colors, so I have a process for everything I do that I can always refer back to and that I can sometimes follow in reverse to undo things. I usually make extra copies before and after each major change, too.

Also, when I say sleep deprivation, I'm talking 5 hours sleep instead of 7 as opposed to a true "all-nighter", and my body doesn't react with loss of focus, it just causes me to crash hard and start nodding off between 7:30-9 PM the following day. If I make it through that I can stay up again like nothing happened; if I actually go to sleep, I'll sleep 11-13 hours straight.

Having those processes in place let me knock this out last night: An anon on the booru hooked me up with the Nao model I hadn't been able to get, and it only took about 5 hours to do a head separation and cleanup, prep a new body (at a size proportion I hadn't done an edit before at or it would have been even faster), edit new skin and bikini textures, fix wonky normals, create a new hair sphere, match the head/neck seams properly and fix facials. She's 99% done, I just need to add in the movable tongue and associated facials.

UNfortunately, the original editor seems to have changed his TOS since he released the Karen model; he doesn't allow R-18 content any more, so I'm not going to add her to the pack just yet. That's going to wait until I have her gamerip hair and I'll make a new face for her then (like Miku). In the meantime I'm just going to do a low-key distribution of her by herself without putting her on the booru and ask people to be careful about what videos they put her in and where they upload it.

Because we all know that's nothing to worry about ¬_¬
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Old 07-04-2018, 01:42 AM   #1535
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Anyone know where I can get the model here (Altina Orion)?
https://www.bilibili.com/video/av24657361/
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Old 07-04-2018, 02:54 AM   #1536
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Ok, finished Nao. This is the only place I'm uploading her, for now.

Please remember, I don't censor anything I upload but the original editor has a no-R18 rule now, so do whatever you want but be careful what you put on the internet and where you put it.
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Old 07-06-2018, 02:26 AM   #1537
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And that's one fan character done. Her hair has no rigging whatsoever, but it's so short that's probably for the best. Maybe I'll think about that later. According to her creator, dowao0126, her name is Reina Okoe (尾越麗奈).

Fun fact: Her bikini color is the same as Ranko's would have been if I hadn't darkened it up before release. I wish I could dupe her dominatrix outfits but they're just way too complex.

Now I'm working on the other, her bangs went faster than I thought they would considering how weird they are and how I have to eyeball everything I do, but a couple of things I thought wouldn't be trouble, are: Namely, trying to find that pin in her hair and the ties on her buns (they're not just Yayoi's like I thought they were, they're a more complex braided rope). I searched all the Idolmaster costume sets I had and they weren't in any of them; the guy who designed her must have either made them himself or found them somewhere else.
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Old 07-09-2018, 02:34 AM   #1538
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And second fancharacter done. This one was created by Shosuke Kagura, whose designs I already used for drill-hair Iori and "Age 14" Takane, and her name is Kanori Kagura (神楽叶織). She's basically the result of what would happen if Haruka and Miki and Iori and Yayoi all got together and played Limp Biscuit and then dumped the leftovers in Chihaya's pussy and she got pregnant from it. In the end I wasn't able to figure out where the hair scrunchie came from (they're surprisingly hard to find, period) so I just ran Yayoi's through the High-Poly plugin. I found her hairclip when I was five minutes from giving up and trying to make it myself; she has a third, twin-pigtails hair design but I have no clue where to get the hair for it, so I'm not even going to try. She uses Haruka's skin and hair colors, Yayoi's eye color and Reika's bikini and nail colors.

Now comes my conundrum. Do I distribute them? I made these copies using publicly available parts and anyone else could do the same if they made the time investment, but even though they're based on Idolmaster, they're still ORIGINAL CHARACTER DO NOT STEAL, and while my younger self would have just said "fuck it" and uploaded them, I'm really not looking to provoke a trans-Pacific shitstorm.
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Old 07-09-2018, 01:18 PM   #1539
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And second fancharacter done. This one was created by Shosuke Kagura, whose designs I already used for drill-hair Iori and "Age 14" Takane, and her name is Kanori Kagura (神楽叶織). She's basically the result of what would happen if Haruka and Miki and Iori and Yayoi all got together and played Limp Biscuit and then dumped the leftovers in Chihaya's pussy and she got pregnant from it. In the end I wasn't able to figure out where the hair scrunchie came from (they're surprisingly hard to find, period) so I just ran Yayoi's through the High-Poly plugin. I found her hairclip when I was five minutes from giving up and trying to make it myself; she has a third, twin-pigtails hair design but I have no clue where to get the hair for it, so I'm not even going to try. She uses Haruka's skin and hair colors, Yayoi's eye color and Reika's bikini and nail colors.

Now comes my conundrum. Do I distribute them? I made these copies using publicly available parts and anyone else could do the same if they made the time investment, but even though they're based on Idolmaster, they're still ORIGINAL CHARACTER DO NOT STEAL, and while my younger self would have just said "fuck it" and uploaded them, I'm really not looking to provoke a trans-Pacific shitstorm.
I don't use idolmaster models, so i'm fine without it.
if you think someone will want it then upload it, if its just for hopes to see it posted in a video, it might not be worth the risk. I keep seeing the same models used when it comes to idolmaster.
its seem pretty niche, so unless the "original" author is zelous, i doubt it will raise any problems.
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Old 07-09-2018, 08:12 PM   #1540
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Quote:
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I don't use idolmaster models, so i'm fine without it.
if you think someone will want it then upload it, if its just for hopes to see it posted in a video, it might not be worth the risk. I keep seeing the same models used when it comes to idolmaster.
its seem pretty niche, so unless the "original" author is zelous, i doubt it will raise any problems.
I think I'm going to hold off for the time being, nobody seems to have come running in begging for them and I really just wanted to see if I could do it. If the original makers wanted them to be publicly available they'd probably have uploaded them already.

The ironic thing is that dowao0126, the creator of Reina, actually made his own version of Kanori (which imho is less accurate than mine) and Shosuke Kagura knows about it, but he's not distributing it, which I assume is why there hasn't been a dispute. Also it seems like Shosuke Kagura censors all nudies of Kanori unless you pay him money on Patreon to see the goods, and interfering with his revenue stream is the last thing I want to do.

I'll compromise; if anyone out there really wants them, I'll upload a few textures and spheres I made and used in the models' creations and list a "recipe" of the parts I used. People who are good with PMDEditor should be able to get a similar result if they follow it.

Reina Okoe
Face: Kurauchi's Ranko Kanzaki w/modified texture (get it from Kurauchi's OneDrive or my Cinderella Girls bikini set here or on the booru); the lip texture is a little different than the one from my base sets
Body: My modified Idolmaster bikini set (get it in the model thread or the booru)
Body size ratio: 1.0
Breast/hip size: Medium-large
Hair and hair texture: Sims 4 hair by Milionna @ DeviantArt (link), resized: X and Y scale 1.25, Z scale 1.3
Sphere files: My modified Idolmaster bikini set

Kanori Kagura
Face: Kurauchi's Haruka Amami (get it from Kurauchi's OneDrive or my modified Idolmaster bikini set here or on the booru)
Body: My modified Idolmaster bikini set (get it in the model thread or the booru)
Body size ratio: 0.97
Breast/hip size: Medium
Hair (first version): A composite of four Idolmaster characters (Yayoi for the main hair, Iori for the front hairline and sideburns, Haruka for the bangs and Miki for the ahoge; heavy editing is required!) plus two round buns (I made them using the simple primitive function in PMDEditor); I used Yayoi's hair scrunchies
Hair (second version): Same front hairline, bangs and ahoge, with Yayoi's hair parts being replaced with Chihaya's hair
Hairclip: The main part is made by Rin.. (link here) and the Idolmaster "A" logo comes from the Shiny Festa set by Kouhi (link)
All needed parts for her except the hairclip can be had from my modified Idolmaster bikini set.

Some manual UV remapping may be necessary for the hairclip; also both models will need their heads repositioned vertically, Reina is the same height as Haruka (add 0.171 to Y position) and Kanori is the same height as Iori (subtract 0.513 to Y position).
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